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kinginexile
08-25-2005, 11:43 PM
I don't mean it so severely, but maybe that will encourage a discussion. And they may think inversely from portrait/scenes photographers.
Point is, I write so many critiques, good ones, to "landscapers", and never mind my shots are not perfect, it's granted, but since the spirit of TE is to share, I am a bit perplexed it gets so little feedback, when I compile all the landscape critiques i've done in 11 months. Is it because i am not really myself a landscaper (so far!).

It can be that I write on contributions whose posters rarely critique, but I have a hard time bringing myself to double-check that when i appreciate a shot from someone.

Unfortunately, I must say this happens with quite a few members who shoot scenes and portraits too, but that may be evryone's lot, when we critique profusively.

Not crying, or ranting (well,a few seconds every other day ;-) ) Just wanted to share this with you.

PixelTerror
08-26-2005, 07:53 AM
Hi Herve,
Not many reactions so far but an interesting discussion topic...
I'm not sure it's only related to a particular photographers style, I am a landscape photographer and had similar experiences with people or B&W shooters when I happened to comment their photos. I must confess, I do not do it so often, because it's difficult for me to write something meaningful and interesting to read for the poster about such pics, "cute kiddie, great DoF" is not exactly what I like to write. I'm also a bit bored by some highly repetitive portrait themes I can see here, like SE Asia children, visiting such a gallery I'd tend to focus on the different photo, like the wise old chinese man that pops up here and there. I guess portrait photographers would have similar reactions viewing a gallery dedicated to sunsets, yet another somewhat boring subject.
The good side is the diversity found here, with so many (good) photographers and styles around, I have no problem finding 20 appealing photos / day to comment, I'm aware I miss exchanges with interesting persons, but there are other ways to get in touch with them, like this thread here ;-)
So no worries, just keep posting and having fun !
Jean-Yves

jmdaoudal
08-26-2005, 11:55 AM
Je préfère répondre dans ma langue maternelle pour preciser d'une part que Jean Yves répond parfaitement en exprimant ce qui se passe ici et à TL, les familles se font par specialité, et il y a une certaine timidité et un manque de goût à visiter des specialités qui ne sont pas les notres.
cependant un grand portrait est une grande photo et est suffisamment attirant pour qu'un non specialiste aille y dire son émotion.
Quelque soit notre tendance nous devons aller vers toute les expressions et nous devons aussi conquerir les autres photographes qui ne sont pas de "notre famille".
Il faut donc parler de ce sujet et reflechir individuellement pour faire des paysages qui attirent les portraitistes et des portraits qui attirent les paysagistes.
jean Michel

kinginexile
08-26-2005, 08:50 PM
Merci, J-M.
I was afraid that i may inflame people, and i appreciate that both of you so far did not pick up on the "catching" title.
To me, landscape is a portrait of nature, and portrait is a landscape of a human being. I am sure someone said that before, and once you've said it, nothing has been done. The photographer has to instill in others the reasons why he thought this was a meaningful image to take. It can work on many levels, usually a landscape can be on its own to be captivating, often with portraits (save the really great ones), a suite of pictures, a gallery/portfolio conveys even better the vision and emotion of the photographer.

AdrianW
08-26-2005, 09:07 PM
It may simply be that many landscape photographers have a different critiquing pattern to you. I'm not a big fan of "you write me a critique, I'll write you one (or two) back", if I see something that hasn't already been commented to death then I'll chime in - but really, is it likely that anyone's going to say anything meaningful after the first 74 points to that shot have already been thrown on? Probably not ;) Then it's just points for the sake of points. If I don't have anything useful to say, I keep it my mouth shut, and critique another image that <i>hasn't</i> already been done to death...

That said there are a couple of highly critiqued landscape photographers who seem to solely be here to raise awareness for their commercial sites, rather than to actually participate in the community. I know Adam doesn't like us naming names, so I won't, but if you see someone with >1000points, but no star, it's time to wonder what they're doing here IMO. Those are people guaranteed not to get any critiques from me - no matter how much useful feedback I have for them :)

kinginexile
08-26-2005, 09:23 PM
I'm not a big fan of "you write me a critique, I'll write you one (or two) back"
----------------------------------
well, as you said, it's as you see it. To me, it has nothing with owing someone, or playing the points game. There are no better words than sharing, and curiosity. about someone who came to "knock at your door" with the same love of photography as you do. I find it immensely pleasurable to look at others shots, and the quality or intent is such, it is hard to find a gallery where there is not at least one shot that makes you want to reach out to the person, either as a response to the interest they showed you, or forwarding one's appreciation first.

nmess
08-27-2005, 03:16 AM
Hmm.. deep subject. I was thinking that this sounded like an interesting idea, since I like to shoot landscapes, but not exclusively. I asked myself, what would charateristics would one need to possess to be considered one, so I looked it up.
I thought this excerpt from Wikipedia would be something to consider, so read on:

Sectarianism refers to fixed and closed attitudes to politics, social movements, religious belief, and human relations. Sectarians are typically idealists, whose thinking has developed in abstraction from, or as a distortion from, practical experience. This leads to continual overestimation and underestimation, exaggerated expectations and unjustified disappointments, and often a super-politicisation (i.e., trivial phenomena are imbued with political significance).

Some believe that the inflexible psychology of sectarians leads to externalization of blame, addiction, psychological transference of emotions, paranoia and other pathological mental states. One might ask if this type of anti-sectarianism is a type of sectarian close-mindedness?

This question suggests that decrying or demonising all kinds of ideas and practices as "sectarian" might become just as bad as sectarianism itself. That is, labelling something or someone "sectarian" might be a convenient ploy to evade taking what somebody says or does seriously, and evade real argument.

jmdaoudal
08-27-2005, 11:36 AM
Thats true about some goal for some photographers (every theme) purchasing very personnal goals, they are useful even if they don't talk in critique, because it helps simply to look and read critiques to them, but it helps more when according to a good level in photography you talk to people to say emotion, artistic and technical points.
We should promote to be in the site philosophy, a photo, a note including technical points and knowledge on the person, the action or the Landscape, and a critique in three points :
emotion or interest for the subject, artistic and technical point.... I am sure a lot of people are able to do this at the moment they survived on the site with a sufficient level in photography, and they can do it whatever the subject is (or they will catch the level in practising this, learning or improving in photography is also write).
And of course go as often as possible to other theme we realise ourself.
JM

kikvel
08-27-2005, 04:09 PM
In a sense, we prefer to critique what makes us feel more comfortable maybe, a B/W guy would critique mainly B/W photography, a landscape photographer would do same with landscapes...

That is normal, I believe and it is a personal liking, no wrong or bad here, just the way it is...

Of course the more open you are to new things, more chances you have to increase your skills and eye.

my two cents;

Cesar

kinginexile
08-27-2005, 08:26 PM
Glad i started my OP asking people not to take the title too seriously. The idea was simply to sound a bell to engage people on the topic of not so much landscape and portraits/scenes, but also the philosophy of the site, which is really about sharing, and reciprocity. Again, not because one feels it is due, but to get support and encouragement in a craft that needs feedback from others to improve. Photography is one of the most ubiquitous presence in our lives, we are surrounded by photos, much more than any other art, save architecture. In that sense, we all participate in its becoming and evolution, the public, the artist, and the communities they sometimes form, as on TE.

Yamada
08-28-2005, 01:09 AM
I love landscape shots very much. And I try to give comment on them as much aas possible. But the sheer amount of pictures uploaded makes that I do miss a lot og them :(